|
|
|
| Organizations (1242 Posts)
|
| Name |
Organizations |
|
Olympics
|
|
On 12/3/2001
Jack
wrote in from
(216.207.nnn.nnn)
Skateboarding in the Olympics...one of my favorite topics. I may be in the minority on this issue, however, I think that skateboarding should be in the Olympics.
Back in the early 80's there was actually a group that was advocating skateboarding's inclusion as an exhibition sport at the 1984 Los Angeles Olympiad. However, the skateboard industry in all their wisdom would not support the group's efforts. Their "reason"..."skateboarding doesn't need the Olympics". Boy that's smart. No, skateboarding didn't need the Olympics, but just think of the exposure it would have given the sport when it was at a low point in 1984. Countries throughout the world would have put together teams to compete. And maybe, just maybe these countries, including the USA would have recognized the need for public skateboarding facilities.
Oh, what's that you say...skateboarders would never wear uniforms. Skateboarders have always worn uniforms.
I guarantee you, tell a kid he's made the Olympic skateboarding team and he'll wear whatever you tell him to wear. Does anyone remember the closing ceremonies of the Atlanta Olympics? Remember the skate/BMX/inline portion?
What would you call those outfits?
Ok. I'm off the soap box. As always thanks for reading.
PS - I have been begun corresponding with the Greek Olympic Organizing Committee regarding the possibilty of including slalom skateboarding as an exhibition/test sport in 2004.
|
|
|
|
|
KHRT
|
|
On 12/3/2001 Boardman
wrote in from
(12.80.nnn.nnn)
OK, an interview w/ Mr. ARA - Peter Camann is up and coming. this should give everyone a good insight as to what goes on to put together a series of racing. Even though his ideas and procedures are 20 plus years old many of these issues keep coming up.
If there is a sanctioning body, then it should be by the skaters for the skaters.
I have always paid for my own hotel room. I wouldn't want someone else making my accomodations.
Vert is not dead, it is highly underground and you would have to perform harsh torture to get info out of a die hard for his pool stash. Leave the 1/2 pipes for the X games.
NO to ISSA. I don't even know if I like the idea of a sanctioning body but will consider if things are done for the skaters.
I went to La Costa to have fun. I paid my $50 to race. I was NOT disappointed.
See you all at WLAC or Rooster's
|
|
|
|
|
USSSF is not elitist.
|
|
On 12/3/2001 lbk
wrote in from
(209.244.nnn.nnn)
loneskater,
I think you might have it backwards. Those that want to make slalom skateboarding an elitist sport are probably the most against GBJ's USSSF ideas. But on the other hand, there are those that I call the "apathetic slalomers" that so far have only taken from slaloming but are not ready to take the risks & personal costs it requires to give anything back. I'm not harshing on the apathetic slalomers skateboarders, instead I'm just pointing it out the way I see it. Something like the USSSF might be the way that the apathetic slalomer can give something back and become involved even if it just in membership dues and showing up to contests.
By the way, come on out to the Gathering for a good time slaloming and healthy discussion about slaloming.
|
|
|
|
|
ISSA, USSSF, Dead Vert, & the Olympics
|
|
On 12/3/2001 lbk
wrote in from
(209.244.nnn.nnn)
Don't even bother to read this:
-> The ISSA is defunct.
-> In contrast to the ISSA, would not the USSSF promote slaloming as we enjoy it today.
-> Vert is rotting dead. When was the last time anyone put on a non elitist, aka "backyard", vert contest?.... OK I'll let you in a secret, vert is alive but it is way underground and in the form of pool skating. But officially it is dead and I like it that way. In other words, slalom skateboarding is larger than vert skating. How's that for a cyclical throw back to the 70's.
-> Support the USSSF idea and hold more local "backyard" slalom contests. Then invite the new schoolers. This is how we pass the sport on!
-> Lastly, slalom skateboarding in the Olympics is a pipe dream that I for one am not ready to smoke.
DR
|
|
|
|
|
La Costa
|
|
On 12/3/2001
slappy
wrote in from
(64.236.nnn.nnn)
Adam T,
I think 90% of the people that attended La Costa would disagree with your assessment of the race. The fastest person DID win the race. Olson kicks ass!
The fastest NASCAR(Indy, Pro bike, horse) racer in time trials doesn't automatically win the race. They just get pole position.
Head to head requires more strategy and endurance than combining the scores of a few runs. Plus you have a chance to race a lot in one day.
I respect your opinion, but head to head is the way to go!
Slappy
|
|
|
|
|
USSA
|
|
On 12/3/2001
adam t
wrote in from
(208.203.nnn.nnn)
Hey Scabs,
Thanks for the response. I appreciate your point(s) and believe that a good idea should be able to stand on it's own. Our opinions are valuable as participants.
Some things:
1. "Can you imagine Henry having to pay for all the entrants motel rooms?"
I didn't imagine anyone into office and don't expect anyone to pay the bills. Is this the reason the ISSA exsists? If it is, surely I agree with you but I don't think this is ISSA's direction.
2."Would you as the promoter of your event want 3 others from differrent locales to be the ones setting the course?
I think three people from other areas would be great way to set a course. I don't have experience traveling and running others courses, so this is all ethereal for me, but I think the idea of sharing that responsibility promotes a community idea of a racers course. Yes, I think that would be good idea but then again, I'm not a "name" in the sport.
3. "Would you want ISSA members to se the only ones to compete?"
I think in order to "grow" the sport of slalom racing, an organization needs to be in place. The ISSA is a model, maybe not the best, but one that is in place and has been proven by the test of time. There will always be "grass roots" racing for the rest of us.
4. "no no no and NO to ISSA. We need an organization that is flexible to some extent and actually promotes or encourages others to participate."
Well, I should understand that you already have your mind made up. Yes, the sport needs an organization to promote and encourage others to participate. I think the NCDSA is doing a fine job of this. It also needs a serious organization to promote "organized racing" This is why I mentioned the ISSA.
The fact that the ISSA web site is not "updated" does make me wonder. But then again, I have not investigated this. I lost track of the global by looking at the local community here. I think I will shoot Jani and others a e-mail and ask him what his opinion is on the "USA" school of thought if he has followed all of this.
I did not make it to La Costa and I find my information about it here. I'm interested in seeing slalom skateboarding in the Olympics. I think it is THE form of skateboarding to actually have a chance. Unfortunately, I don't think La Costa, from what I have read, is the role model for serious racing. Did the fastest person win? No, it was about "head to head" racing, a viable form, but not the only one. I'ts all good, please, don't get me wrong, I like the vibe. But it is a different direction, one that was based more on a gathering and that is totally alright too.
I think it is time to get serious as well as promoting the sport. There is room for both, isn't there? In order to be taken seriously by the olympic commitee, we need to be serious. There is also room for fun.
In order to advance skateboard racing, we need to get serious about rules and timing. If I am not mistaken, the ISSA has already done this.
Scabs, thanks for your comments, I take no offense and I hope you take none from mine. The NCDSA is a great web site, an excellent public forum. I hope all of our words ring the bell of truth.
Have a great day,
adam t
|
|
|
|
|
khrt
|
|
On 12/3/2001 cfavero
wrote in from
(64.12.nnn.nnn)
hey,like i sais before,i am not tryin to be negative,i just want to be careful.any sanctioning body should be a slave to its members,and the authourity should really rest in the members hands also.it takes a special person to lead a sanctioning body,somebody selfless who truly loves the sport ans also understands that if it ultimately fails ,can do way more harm than good.i am glad people are so passionate on this site,that is very healthy.passion is always the igniter.i do not disagree with the need for more organization,i just always want it to be fun.cf
|
|
|
|
|
?
|
|
On 12/3/2001
Paul K
wrote in from
(195.110.nnn.nnn)
what about The Unified Slalom Association!!
Blast!!!, that three letter acronym has already been used
Paul K
KHRT UK
|
|
|
|
|
ISSA not
|
|
On 12/2/2001
Scabs
wrote in from
(66.21.nnn.nnn)
Adam T,
The rules for the ISSA take the flow out of slalom skateboarding. Can you imagine Henry having to pay for all the entrants motel rooms? Would you as the promoter of your event want 3 others from differrent locales to be the ones setting the course? Would you want ISSA members to se the only ones to compete?
no no no and NO to ISSA. We need an organization that is flexible to some extent and actually promotes or encourages others to participate.
So its not actually reinventing the wheel but more like perfecting it.
Oh, and did you notice that site has not been updated in almost 3 years?
|
|
|
|
|
go for it
|
|
On 12/2/2001
loneskater
wrote in from
(159.87.nnn.nnn)
vert skating isn't dead. skating is cyclic. i have heard for years skateboarding is dead at different times. just the other day a youngster at the park asked me if skating was dying. i told him no it was just going to be dormant for a while if he wanted to quit it was on him. but, cities are building parks with vert, you always have to search for you own pools and there are alot of virgin ditches waiting to be ridden.
slalom is a different animal. it is being resurected by us old guys, so how are you going to make it appeal to younger skaters? i don't have an answer for you. it scares most of them to death (at speed) but they will still call it gay, go figure.
|
|
|
|
|
ISSA
|
|
On 12/2/2001 adam t
wrote in from
(208.203.nnn.nnn)
http://www.pcpal.fr/issa/
Why re-invent the wheel?
These guys (ISSA) are organized. I believe that J.Gilmour, Paul Dunn, Beau Brown could really speak from experience about competition in this organization. I've followed it from a distance for years, love reading their "Slalom" magazine (from long ago) and well, they have already done their homework. It is a great organization and I wonder why for the most part, it is ignored over here???
adam t (with all due respect)
|
|
|
|
|
usssf
|
|
On 12/2/2001 slappy
wrote in from
(205.188.nnn.nnn)
Another thought for the lack of funds equation is volunteering. you could have reduced rates for racers who volunteer at events, etc.
Or have volunteering as an optional way of achieving points to a season of racing.
|
|
|
|
|
The time is now for the USSSF
|
|
On 12/2/2001
longboardkook
wrote in from
(209.244.nnn.nnn)
If we don't strike while the iron is hot and pass slalom skateboarding on to the next generation then slalom skateboarding will die.
Just look at vert skating. Vert skating is on it's last breath. Once ESPN realizes that kids today have no real interest in vert skating, they will pull the spotlight from the sport and vert will be D.O.A. Do we want to let Slalom Skateboarding to die also? We can only ride this slalom thing the way it is for so much longer. Just take a look at the arguments that broke out after probably the best event ever, La Costa.
USSSF at the very least will the ESA (East Coast Surfing Association) of slalom. That alone would be worth it. We having nothing to loose by getting organized and keeping the momentum rolling. Jack, Henry, GBJ and others can only push slaloming so far before they get burnt out or start stepping on each other's events.
When it comes down to it, we can't just keep taking from slalom skateboarding and think it will always be there for us. Every one as a slalom skateboarder needs to put something back into slalom skateboarding. It could be volunteer time, it could be money, or it could be both. Hell, if skaters in Gilmour's shoes can't afford a membership to the USSSF, so what. They will just pay a slightly higher entry fee for any USSSF supported events. But, the USSSF will be there for the greater good of all slalom skateboarders including those that are not members of the USSSF.
So support the idea of USSSF and lets get it started now!
DR
|
|
|
|
|
Organizations
|
|
On 12/2/2001
psYch0Lloyd
wrote in from
(24.148.nnn.nnn)
cfavero speaks from the heart. Grassroots racing events should also have their place in all this too.
|
|
|
|
|
khrt
|
|
On 12/2/2001
cfavero
wrote in from
(64.12.nnn.nnn)
hey, i'm not trying to neg,alan and i had a similar converstation earlier in te week.pretty much about how cool all the backyard ramp contests were in the early 80's.the vibe,the get together,people scrapin to go for a weekend contest.nobody bitched about the ramp,seldom the judging and best of all,there were no large sanctioning bodies,just a bunch of small groups of people who threw these things together(remember the M.E.S.S. series?).i get the same vibe when i read a lot of the posts and to tell the truth,thats probably the reason i am as stoked aboutslalom and down hill the way i am right now.really rediscovering that sense of fun that contests can be that vert and street have lost a long ,long time ago. i am not against more organization,just the lessons of the past are to painful,cf
|
|
|
|
|
CRA
|
|
On 12/2/2001
hugh r
wrote in from
(205.216.nnn.nnn)
I would suggest a different name... maybe "Cone Runners Assoc" CRA... or "Slalom Person Assoc" SPA... or "World Wide Slalam Assoc" WWSA...
Too many letters are hard for some of us to manage! HR
|
|
|
|
|
NSSF
|
|
On 12/2/2001 Glen
wrote in from
(216.102.nnn.nnn)
Thanks for clearing up your point GBJ.
|
|
|
|
|
USSSF
|
|
On 12/2/2001 Bman
wrote in from
(12.80.nnn.nnn)
i am glad that racing will not be resatricted to USSSF members only. . You have been e-mailed.....
|
|
|
|
|
USSSF (pronounced: U-triple S-F)
|
|
On 12/2/2001
GBJ
wrote in from
(24.38.nnn.nnn)
But to be clear... my plans do not include mandated membership for participants in USSSF sanctioned or promoted events. Nor do my plans include anything that specifies that USSSF members cannot participate in non-USSSF sanctioned events. I may personally suggest that members follow their own money with support and loyalty, but the USSSF, as hopefully chartered, will not be in the business of controlling the lives and activities of its' members.
|
|
|
|
|
USSSF
|
|
On 12/2/2001
GBJ
wrote in from
(24.38.nnn.nnn)
Boardman, The membership rates have yet to be determined. In fact, the membership categories have yet to be clearly defined. These choices are all part of the chartering process, and suggestions such as yours are part of it. There are many facets to the discussion of implementing your suggestion, and how such programs can operate within the structure of an association business. I'd love to discuss them with you at length. Send me an e-mail address.
|
|
|
|
|
USSSF
|
|
On 12/2/2001 Boardman
wrote in from
(12.80.nnn.nnn)
GBJ - I like your idea. Her's something else to consider....
-What about the guy that only wants to race once in a sanctioned race or a couple of times a year? Maybe a "participation fee" for only that race? Make it reasonable but break it up the membership costs ( is that $100 per year?) divided by the # of sanctioned races and add that fee seperately to the entry fee. Sort of a trial membership. If the racer does pays enough sanction fees to race then deduct the amount previously paid if any and give them a membership or let them pay remaining balance for membership if they decide they want to join.
BTW - quite an epistle for a vicodin induced stupor!
Bman
KHRT Think (maybe not) Tank
|
|
|
|
|
USSSF
|
|
On 12/2/2001
GBJ
wrote in from
(24.38.nnn.nnn)
Glen, I certainly understand and agree with your point. As Carl pointed out, it's the biblical story of the widow who gave ger mite, which I, as a National Cathedral docent, have the opportunity to tell several times a week. However, I don't think that you're seeing that I'm discussing something different. I'm not talking about the "Haves" and the "Have Nots", and their relative abilities to give, by proportion. I am discussing another well-known human tendancy, addressed in other biblical tales and children's stories, wherein: nobody wants to help Henny Penny go through growing and grinding the grain, and then baking the bread, but when the bread is finished, and smells and looks oh, so good... everybody's willing to help her eat it. I'm not talking about the relative difference between the millionaire who gives .0001% of his fortune and still makes a notable financial difference, and the indigent homeless man who reaches into his nearly empty pocket and gives the only dollar in his pocket, 100% of his financial strength. I'm talking about the people who seem to give to the extent of their capabilities and then follow it up my giving more in the form of "doing", when contrasted with people who wouldn't voluntarily contribute to anything, unless, of course, they see that they actually stand to immediately gain something of greater value than they've just given.
I don't know. While it wasn't my intention to flatter, I do believe I just expressed that I feel a person who is a ready, willing, volutary contributor, like yourself, is a "better" person than a person who manages to always be un-ready, and unwilling to contribute. It probably could've been a compliment, and I admire that you're not necessarily in it for the compliments. I just know that if I haven't managed to get you to see that, in many ways, we're making the same differentiations in people, but that you seem to want to discuss it in an Apples-and-Oranges fashion that makes it sound like we actually disagree, then I don't know how else to explain myself.
|
|
|
|
|
???
|
|
On 12/2/2001 C-Money
wrote in from
(152.163.nnn.nnn)
I just had to comment on Glen's retelling of the biblical parable of the widow's mite (where Jesus points out her giving out of her poverty. . .) and GBJ's quoting (not exactly, but close enough) the great Arlo Guthrie's Alices Restaurant (with the circles and arrows, and a paragraph on the back o' each on, 'splainin what each one was. . .).
What a literary bunch we've become.
But, seriously folks-I'll join an organization that has to do with Slalom and seems to have half it's s@$% together.
Carl Kincaid
|
|
|
|
|
Orgs. and the law
|
|
On 12/2/2001
Mad Hack
wrote in from
(211.12.nnn.nnn)
I think it is a function of organizations (knuckleheads included) to take their strength in numbers to fight city by-laws which would take away the property which we all pay for in taxes away from us. Some cities are blessed with beautiful pristine but unrideable hills, made so by retrograde legislation designed to keep people off the streets. This, aside from all the usual administrative stuff, is one of the functions that larger organizations can serve.
|
|
|
|
|
usssf
|
|
On 12/2/2001
Mad Hack
wrote in from
(211.12.nnn.nnn)
If you were a millionaire you wouldn't drop anything into a pot unless you were going to get some return on it--tax deductions, whatever. If you were a millionaire doing it for the reasons GBJ considers better, would it be $100? Not likely. Why do poor people give more to panhandlers and tip better at restaurants? Because they feel an affinity with the people they are "giving" their money to, and, Glen, I think you do too, beyond any sacrifice.
People are the same with taxes (especially, from what I can gather, in the States)--they pay as little as possible and expect an "equal" return. Why else don't you guys have health insurance? Because every politician who wants to get elected has to promise tax cuts out of one side of their mouth, and out of the other side of their mouth promise to give big business more money.
GBJ, I think you are right. People are going to compare "promoters" with "big business" and "organizations" with government. People should remember, however, that big business (at least publicly) despises government because it despises democracy (privately they love it, however--check out how much these rich corps. get in welfare). People have no control or influence over corporations (here people equals "racers"). There is no reason, though, that racers can't all work together under some organization, and that organization in turn with promoters and companies/sponsors. It's a large undertaking and progress would be slow, require great effort and most of all patience. If something is truly democratic, things take a long time to decide and to agree upon. Do people have the time and the will?
As far as precision of expression, I've not read anybody as precise and accurate as GBJ, Don O'Shei and Chris Chaput and their posts are long. Long does not mean "not concise." Others have their own economy of expression, yet often require more assumptions made by reading between the lines. Others just "walk softly and carry a big stick."
|
|
|
|
|
